| Is the Chinese language dead? | |
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| Feb 26, 2007 20:20 | #11   |
 | Good on yaz, Stocktov and Rogerinca, well said. My two fen worth will start with taking Griz up on one of his own points: 无线电. Let's look at this properly: 无线 is a common prefix equivalent to the English 'wireless'. For example, I am currently using a 无线网卡/wireless internet card to get online. But wait! How can this be? English has used the exact some process as Chinese to express this new concept! 'Wireless' means without wires, just like 无线! So is English dead too? As Stocktov said, all languages (except those that are dead, of course) evolve. That process of evolution includes recombining words or 'particles' (as in the prefix-root-suffix model common in European languages) to create new words to fit new concepts. "biotechnology - word not found in the Wenlin dictionary" Two things: 1: Not all words in any language are to be found in the dictionary. And why check Wenlin? Sure, it's a good resource, but it's hardly the authority on the Chinese language. It's not the Chinese OED. 2: Clearly your knowledge of Chinese isn't what you would have us believe. I don't know the word for biotech either, not off the top of my head, but if I were translating for someone and had to make an educated guess, I would say "生物技术." And you know what? The pinyin input system gives me the exact characters I want without me having to change any, which is a good indication I have the right word. And just to confirm, I look in the dictionary, and although 生物技术 itself is not listed, there are plenty of other words using 生物 as the equivalent of the English prefix 'bio-', which makes me feel pretty confident I've got the right word. |
| Feb 26, 2007 20:21 | #12 |
| "How would the Chinese language invent new words?" As you yourself have demonstrated, one method is the same as that used in any other language- rearranging or recombining old words to form new words. "Wouldn't new characters need to be created?" Not always, but yes, sometimes. When paper was invented, the Chinese people needed a word for it, and that word needed a character, and that's how we wound up with 纸. "Is the lack of such a mechanism an indication that the Chinese language is dead? Or is there such a mechanism in place and I simply do not know of it." Well, you've answered your own question: You clearly don't know enough about the Chinese language. As Rogerinca pointed out, Chinese does have a mechanism for creating new characters. All but the simplest characters are made up of 'radicals'. Radicals are basically simple characters, sometimes stripped down or altered to fit comfortably in a more complex character. Radicals are combined to form new characters. Chinese has been doing this since the days of the oracle bones. A good example would be the Table of Chemical Elements. Obviously many elements required a new character as the were unknown to the Chinese (indeed, to everybody around the world) only 100 or 200 years ago. If you look at the table, you will see many (most? all?) the metals contain the radical 金 in their character. Why? 金 (meaning metal or gold) indicates that this character is the name of a metal. The other radical is usually there for it's phonetic value. "What happens when China - which is educating far more citizens in the sciences than the United States - over takes American dominance of technology and begins to be the creator of new technologies... How will those Chinese inventors pick new words for their inventions?" Well, clearly, the world will stop spinning on its axis, the Earth's magnetic field will reverse, the laws of thermodynamics will no longer apply, and we'll be reduced to grunting like Neanderthals or chimpanzees. Or, more likely, English will start to take on a lot more words from Chinese (and you'd be surprised how many we already have), words that were 'invented' in all the usual ways new words are coined, words that will have new characters or new combinations of characters just like all the previous words that have at some stage been new to Chinese, and life will continue on as it always has. |
| Feb 26, 2007 20:21 | #13 |
| Grrrrr..... Character limits are most irritating. |
| Feb 26, 2007 20:46 | #14 |
| Wow~ applause for you, chriswaughbj. I'm sure your English is pretty pretty good. |
| Feb 26, 2007 21:22 | #15 |
| Thanks, may |
| Feb 27, 2007 01:15 | #16 |
| Hi, some very good points and intelligent observations !!! I was going to get into the ‘radicals’ aspect, but I was too wordy and I had to edit out a lot of my material to fit the post. Quote: “Well, clearly, the world will stop spinning on its axis, the Earth's magnetic field will reverse, the laws of thermodynamics will no longer apply, and we'll be reduced to grunting like Neanderthals or chimpanzees.” This is too funny, and not typical Asian humor style !! LOL :) :) We need more humor in this forum !! Thanks !!  |
| Feb 27, 2007 11:41 | #17 |
| Laws of thermodynamics, In principle, describe the specifics for the transport of heat and work in thermodynamic processes. Since their conception, however, these laws have become some of the most important in all of physics and other branches of science connected to thermodynamics. They are often associated with concepts far beyond what is directly stated in the wording. No longer apply???? |
| Feb 27, 2007 14:49 | #18 |
| He was only joking/being ‘facetious’ to make an illustration !!! :) Facetious: cleverly amusing in tone; a bantering tone; tongue-in-cheek advice; amusing; intended to be humorous; not serious. |
| Feb 27, 2007 16:49 | #19 |
| In my studies of the Chinese language over the past year, I can assure Griz326, as well as the rest the world that the Chinese language is far from being dead. With modern technology, Chinese have been continually reinventing words and creating new ones. Being a Westerner,with 45 years of western education and experiences, the Chinese language appears to be almost impossible to read and write.The character combinations (groups) in a word make interpretation very pragmatic. In fact,the entire written and spoken systemof CHinese language is indefinate and obscure. Perhaps this is because of my science/math background and "left-brained" mentality. To conclude, I have found learning Chinese characters one of the greatest challenges of my life.I willcontinue,with the encouragement of many of my students and mentors, I will become fluent, it just takes time and perservernce....two things that I have a lot of. Peace to all TCG Community members! |
| Feb 27, 2007 20:27 | #20 |
| windenergy, don't give up on the characters, they're not as hard as they first look. Actually, I think you're science/math background will help you, as there is a definite system and logic to the characters. Once you start seeing how they work, you'll see patterns developing which will make the process easier. |
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