| Tell Others Your Travel Traps here! | |
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| Sep 3, 2007 03:38 | #41   |
 | "On the first day, after leaving the bus to go to Tiennamen (sic) Square, we walked several blocks before he asked if anyone wanted to go to a bathroom. Many people did, so he directed them back to a bathroom where they were charged three dollars US for the privilege. A few tour participants were smart enough to "negotiate" down to a dollar for the potty privilege. But wouldn't it have been gracious of the tour leader to walk them back and negotiate a group price?" Ms. Miller claims Yin led the group to a bathroom at Tian'anmen Square that charged $3 U.S. per person for its use. In my life, I have never heard of a bathroom in China charging three U.S. dollars for its use. Rarely, some bathrooms require a payment ... it amounts to 50 cents or less. Some bathrooms have an attendant on hand who cleans the bathroom and accepts donations. Payment is not required, but it is customary to leave two yuan -- 25 cents. Regent's guides will always lead the group to the best bathrooms in the area and will also remind throughout the tour where the best public bathrooms are located so people can use the better facilities if possible. There are no businesses of any kind in China that request U.S. dollars in payment. Officially, tourists are to exchange U.S. dollars for Chinese RMB to purchase Chinese goods. One will never under any circumstances find any shop, vendor, or facility requiring payment in U.S. dollars. Miller's description of this toilet facility sounded to me like a tourist trap. In fact, a check with others on this tour as well as with Yin himself revealed that Yin daily advised the travelers how long it would be from one toilet to the next. (This is necessary in China. Toilet facilities in some areas are rare or unavailable.) To prevent travelers in this group from possible heat stroke because of a heat wave in Beijing, Yin announced he would move them quickly through Tian'anmen Square, which is a large open area with little shade. Some chose to walk back 100 feet to the only bathroom on the square while Yin located a shady location off the square for the others. Yin announced that this was a fee toilet charging 30 cents. The first person, however, returned to say he paid three U.S. dollars. Yin explained the mistake and volunteered to go back with him to receive a return of the money. This person said it was not important. Other members of the group correctly paid 30 cents and there never was an issue of negotiating a "group rate." |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:39 | #42 |
| "The Regent tour used supposedly used 5 star hotels yet you could not get more than one clean towel a day without begging the hotel. At the King Wing Hot Spring Hotel in Beijing it took four calls to housekeeping and the manager to get a second clean towel for a second shower after a hot day of touring. "Tomorrow" they said. And "you have towels." It was true. We had towels. But they were wet and dirty." Beijing's King Wing Hot Springs Hotel (http://www.orientaltravel.com.hk/ res_King_Wing_Hot_Spring_Hotel_Beijing.htm) has one of the finest reputations in the city, used extensively by hundreds of tour groups worldwide. I do not know how many towels Miller uses daily. It should be noted that not one other person out of 38 on this tour commented any displeasure with any of the hotel's services. Every hotel room in fine hotels in China has a myriad of large and small bath towels and washclothes for daily use. As in any fine hotel, the towels are changed daily. Some hotels change the towels twice daily, morning and evening. This kind of complaint has nothing to do with Regent tours and sounds, as in all the other complaints, to be completely rooted in unreality. "All the meals were supposedly included the Regent Tours China tour. Yet, after the orientation, suddenly dinners in Hong Kong were not included." All meals in Regent tours are included except Hong Kong. On the brochure for this tour, one dinner was clearly written as "not included." In the case of this tour, there appeared to be a miscommunication, and the members of the group did not realize that Hong Kong meals were not paid for. What Ms. Miller does not say is that, upon hearing that the group was unaware that the meals in Hong Kong were not included, Regent immediately added them to the schedule without charge. In other words, there was a miscommunication between the agency and the travelers in which travelers did not notice the clearly-marked reference to a meal not being included, but the agency immediately rectified the situation at no expense to the travelers. |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:42 | #43 |
| "One night we begged him to change the schedule so we would be able to climb the Great Wall in the morning when it was cooler. He reassured our entire table of 8 that he would do so. Yet when we got back on the bus, he had reverted to "his" original schedule." Miller's profession is to critique tours, not lead them. The request to visit the Great Wall in the morning was inappropriate. The tours of any agency are laid out by tour professionals who have led these tours over many years for the benefit of all travelers. A tour company takes into account the time, the route, and all of the logistics of travel in order to reach various sights within a few days. One does not arbitrarily change the schedule of a group without inviting serious problems. An excellent example of this would be the Great Wall, which is a nearly two-hour drive outside Beijing and is a rigorous experience that would have travelers exhausted by mid-day if they went in the morning as opposed to the afternoon. In fact, if the group had gone to the Wall first as Miller desired, the drive would have placed them there precisely between 11:00 to 11:30 a.m. -- the hottest time of day, not only the most uncomfortable time to climb the Great Wall, but a time that could lead to the serious possibility of heat stroke. It again should be noted that a heat wave was occurring in Beijing at the time this group was visiting. Normal summer temperatures of approximately 95 to 100 degrees require care in touring open unshaded and physically demanding areas such as the Great Wall. The peak temperature in Beijing that week averaged 120 degrees Fahrenheit. Can you imagine climbing the Great Wall at noon in 120 degrees? The schedule to the Great Wall is precise. On the way, the bus passes a cloisonné factory for an opportunity to see cloisonné artisans at work building, painting, and firing their crafts. Following that, the bus drives another half hour to the Ming Tombs, where the group walks along country roads in remote areas with some light climbing. Then the group rests for lunch and a short visit to a Friendship Store for shopping or browsing, followed by another 45 minute drive to the Great Wall. The Great Wall is an exhilarating, but physically demanding experience. One does not want to be rushed in visiting this site. To suggest beginning the day with this experience, then rushing off to go walking or shopping elsewhere, suggests a lack of knowledge of the physical logistics. After visiting the Great Wall, it is time for the group to wind down and return to the hotel and to dinner. Thus, it is the last place the group visits that day, after which they welcome the ride back to the city and a delicious meal. |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:43 | #44 |
| In fact, it was Miller and only Miller who wanted to go to the Wall in the morning. Once on the bus, Yin explained the reasons for the group to see the Wall in the afternoon and everyone on the bus with the exception of Miller agreed. The bus was parked as close as possible to the Wall entrance (There is no way to park closer than the vendor and entrance area will allow.) and remained on with air conditioning running during the entire afternoon. It did not matter for Ms. Miller, however ... she amazingly did not even join the Great Wall tour! The reason she insisted the group see the Great Wall first was because she assumed she could walk on it for a few minutes and then rush off to shop!! Her request indicated no understanding of the location of the Great Wall nor the isolated country roads that surround it for a nearly two-hour drive. The only way she could spend the day as she wanted, “shopping ? was to stay behind. That is, in fact, precisely what she did. She never bothered to see the Great Wall. It was only a distraction in her visit to China. |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:44 | #45 |
| "Each day, we hoped to return to the hotel to shower and relax before dinner. Yet he always decided to go directly on to dinner. Everyone was hot, tired, and sweaty. Maybe this sounds like too democratic a suggestion, but maybe we could have voted to see if the group would rather return to the hotel to rest before dinner or not." Beijing is a city of tremendous scope. Traffic is heavy, and going from one sight to the next without returning to the hotel saves a great deal of time. Each day the group was advised of the schedule and had an opportunity to return to the hotel first or have more time sightseeing by going directly to dinner. On the day of touring the Summer Palace, the group chose to go directly to dinner and a show. On the day the group visited the Forbidden City, the group chose to return to the hotel for a rest before dinner. In fact, a group tour is not a "democracy." A group tour in a foreign city is led by licensed travel professionals who understand the logistics of their city and speak its language and schedule the tour according to the city's traffic, tourist locations, and physical needs of the group members. Miller was unaware of any of these concerns and was not in a position to determine the "democratic" decision for the group --- which would have been her totalitarian one. The schedule on this tour, because it featured Jewish activities and sights in addition to the Chinese sights, was even more active than standard tours. If one visits my website to see FAQ's about the Jewish Heritage Tours, one will read clearly that the group will often be gone from 8:30 a.m. until 7 or 8 at night. Tours include sights, shows, cruises, and religious services and activities. Those who desire to may call a taxi and, for a fee of about one dollar or less, return to the hotel instead of remaining with the group. Nobody is a prisoner on a Regent China Tour. |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:44 | #46 |
| "And one day we had a "picnic" at the Summer Palace in Beijing. Nice idea, great concept. But the picnic for 40 included one loaf of unsliced bread, crackers, bananas, lychee fruit, 12 cookies, and some fish sausage which almost no one except the guide ate. He claimed he had also bought yoghurt (sic) and chicken sausages, but he left them in his car. (Perhaps if he had an assistant, they could have retrieved them or bought more)" The food for this impromptu picnic was purchased by Regent's guide Millie. Everyone indicated their enjoyment of the fun of eating outdoors and praised the food, including Ms. Miller herself. Nobody complained at the time or, with the exception of Ms. Miller, since. "Actually, the most interesting thing I discovered on this trip was what it must be like to live in a Communist country where all information is controlled by a central source. Our guide would tell us plans were changed because the government wanted to use a certain hall and we had to come another day. Why did the government only give him 24 hours notice? Does this happen to other tourists? And how could we check?" It is statements like this that really get my goat. Ms. Miller knows nothing of life in China and speaks with self-righteous arrogance. When one travels anywhere in the world, including the United States, one faces daily schedule changes and unexpected experiences. In fact, it is not unusual for flights to be canceled suddenly, schedules to be moved, and weather or other circumstances to change daily plans. The entire infrastructure of Beijing was then and continues to be changing daily because of extensive construction to prepare for the 2008 Olympics. Numerous streets and buildings have been completely closed at a moment's notice. |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:46 | #47 |
| "Ying did excel at finding what I call "guide stores," overpriced outlets that obviously paid him a commission. He took us to these "factories" first thing in the morning and never rushed us. In fact, our very first stop, the very first morning was to a pearl factory where my eager group spent several thousand dollars. He must have been thrilled, as he added in some more factories to our schedule." Every agency that provides tours in China guides the tour members to shops and factories where many of the local crafts are intricately produced. As in the case of the Cloisonné Factory, these businesses provide an opportunity to see the artisans at work sculpting, painting, embroidering, and firing their crafts, where one can marvel at the uniqueness and brilliance of these objects. Did Miller happen to notice the 20 to 30 other tour buses in the parking lot of the Pearl Factory during the time she was there? Or at every other one of the "overpriced outlets" she mentions? Those other buses were also taking tourists -- Germans, English, Swedes, Americans, Asians, French --- into the same store to see a display of the oysters being opened and to have an opportunity to purchase some of the finest pearls in China. Factory shops offer authentic items with a 100% guarantee and are designated by the Chinese government for tourists. They are equipped with excellent bathroom facilities and offer goods that cannot be found on the street. Every agency conducting tours to China and every tourguide within China escorts travelers to these shops. Tourists are the first to request to be taken to these shops. They want to purchase cloisonné, jade, silk embroidery and finely crafted furniture -- none of which are available from street vendors. |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:47 | #48 |
| "When a few tour members began to buy things from vendors, Ying gave a stern lecture on the street vendors and how they cheat you. He warned us against buying from them. I could understand his concern. The vendor prices were unbelievably cheap, as cheap as everyone had hoped and dreamed they would be. One tour member bought 30 silk ties for $5. I don't mean $5 each, that was the total for all 30." To suggest that any guides keep tourists from buying from vendors is absurd. At every location the group visits, vendors line the streets and sell to tourists. Inexpensive souvenirs may be purchased everywhere as gifts to take to friends or as a memento. Every tourist comes home with the sound of "One dollah! Five dollah!! Two for one dollah! Ten for five dollah!!" ringing in his/her ears. It is part of the charm? and yes, annoyance? of traveling in China as well as many other countries. For inauthentic items that a vendor claims to be jade, pearls, or silk, however, the vendor charges 50 times the value of the product and the tourist gains an item that is worthless. Five dollars will purchase thirty 100% polyester ties imported from Korea and labeled as silk. One could easily find eighty 100% polyester ties in Beijing for five dollars. Even a child in China knows the value of a 100% silk tie, for which most less expensive stores charge $5 to $10 each, and for which brand name stores charge from $25 to $55. Factories or other shops are never "added to the schedule." The schedule is created before the group arrives and adhered to closely with the exception of the group's vote to add or delete something on occasion. It is true that Regent guides warn their groups that the items they purchase from vendors are not authentic other than as inexpensive souvenirs, with the exception of books and postcards (which also come in varying qualities from vendors). |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:49 | #49 |
| "At the airport, as we left Beijing, Ying passed out a map to each group member. Why I wondered had he waited until we left?" Ms. Miller wonders constantly, yet never seeks facts. Free city maps are available from the front desk at every hotel in every city as they are in every airport. At the airport as the group left the city, Yin saw some maps on the ground that fell from a shelf. He picked them up to place them back on the shelf when someone in the group asked for one, so he distributed them to those who wanted them, then put the remainder on the shelf. From this, Miller "wondered why he waited until we left" to distribute maps. I would recommend she wonder why she doesn't pay attention to what is really happening around her. "His parting words were that transfers would be taken care of in each city. But that did not happen ..." Yin guided the group to obtain boarding cards, then paid airport taxes for them, hugged and shook hands with the members of the group and waited outside while the group went through security. Two hours later, the agent in Xi'an informed him the group was in safe hands. Miller implies that Yin was the only guide throughout the tour and didn't oversee their needs. Yin was the Beijing guide only. From Beijing, they and their national guide joined local guides and drivers in Xi'an, Shanghai, Suzhou, Guilin, and Hong Kong. Every one of these guides took the group members to the airport, saw them off, and saw that they were safely guided to and from each plane and to and from each bus. This is a given. No group is capable of traveling in China without a guide in every city. It is a complex country with extreme language barriers for foreigners. No group in China can be left standing alone in a Chinese airport, wringing their hands, wondering what to do with themselves. Despite this image portrayed by Miller, it is not possible. Every agency operating in China is government-regulated. NO agency would be licensed in China after leaving foreign travelers stranded in airports. |
| Sep 3, 2007 03:50 | #50 |
| "Our transfers involved forty senior citizens, some with canes, bad backs and knee replacements claiming their luggage and then lugging it downstairs, across airports and then on a few blocks to the bus in the parking lot. Why couldn't the bus at least come to us? Or why didn't a team of baggage handlers handle the baggage as promised. We noticed the baggage of other tour groups pulled and neatly gathered for transport to their hotels." This group consisted of 38 travelers, over half of whom were not senior citizens, including Ms. Miller herself. Airports worldwide have their own regulations regarding parking and luggage handling. Each airport in China has a unique arrangement. Regent's national guide Liang Ping, a well-known Judaic scholar in China, confirmed that, regardless of those with canes, bad backs and knee replacements who needed help most, Madelyn Miller -- a healthy and a comparatively young woman -- threw three of her four heavy carry-ons into his hands, preventing him from carrying items for other passengers. An additional description of what Miller did with her luggage to nearly cause serious injury to the group is provided below in a response from Rabbi Merle Singer. "And once we got to our hotels there were often long waits for them to unpack the bus and deliver the bags to the rooms. We once waited over six hours, and had another dinner in sweaty, dirty clothes." Ms. Miller's description of the "long waits" is equivalent to her description of "several blocks" that "many people" walked to get to a toilet on Tian'anmen Square, where "they were charged three dollars US for the privilege." Regent goes out of its way to expedite delivery of luggage to rooms. Regent pays luggage handlers extra to take the bags directly from the airport to the bus, and from the bus to each room -- tour members need not provide any tips. In most cases, luggage arrives at the hotel ahead of the group, as every other member of this tour would confirm. |
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