Sexualharassment is a good thing!

Sexualharassment is a good thing!
Aug 29, 2008 03:59
KATRINA Points: Join Date: Nov 29, 2004 Status: offline	Extracted from Financial Times. Sexualharassment is a good thing: the human race would die out without it. This was the verdict of a judge in Russia last month, dismissing a case brought by a 22-year-old woman in advertising. She had claimed that her boss had told all his female underlings to “signal with their eyes if they desperately wanted to be laid on the boardroom table”. She hadn't realised that he meant this literally and her eyes may have given an inadvertent twitch at some point; when she refused his subsequent and most unwelcome advances, he locked her out of the office. The judge did not dispute the evidence but told the woman that her boss had done nothing remiss: on the contrary, he was simply being gallant. Another story: The story began on a July evening when a group of City lawyers from Shearman & Sterling went out drinking, as City lawyers so often do. After a few drinks, the group fragmented, and an associate peeled off to the Windmill strip club in Soho, taking with him the summer intern, a young female Oxford graduate. It isn't clear what happened once inside but, as a result, the girl filed a complaint to the firm's HR department, claiming that the associate had made suggestive remarks and tried to touch her. The firm looked into the matter, decided the associate had acted in a way that was “deeply inappropriate” and fired him. However, it was also made clear that, as the event was a private one, the firm itself was not liable. What did people react? Half think the story is a savage indictment of life in the City, and shows how wretched it still is for female lawyers, especially young ones. The other half are angry with the stupid woman, and furious that, in a wildly PC world, a lawyer lost his job without having done anything wrong. “HOPE SHE IS PLEASED WITH HERSELF FOR DESTROYING HIS LIFE,” went one post. What's the author's view? I don't think either is, but they share wrongness equally. The man was an idiot. You don't need to be a lawyer to know that strip club, summer intern and clumsy pass all add up to trouble. The intern was an idiot too. Once she realised she was being taken into what its website calls an “upmarket tableside dancing venue” she should have said: “Thanks for a pleasant evening but it's been a long day and I must go home now”, and taken herself off. In itself, this was a story of two silly people on a squalid little night out in London, and is of no particular interest. The sexual harassment in Russia: In that country, only two women have ever won cases for sexual harassment and, in one survey, 100 per cent of women claimed to have been harassed at some point. What do you think of sexual harassment? Is it a good thing?

Aug 29, 2008 03:59

KATRINA
Points:
Join Date: Nov 29, 2004
Status: offline

Extracted from Financial Times.

Sexualharassment is a good thing: the human race would die out without it.

This was the verdict of a judge in Russia last month, dismissing a case brought by a 22-year-old woman in advertising. She had claimed that her boss had told all his female underlings to “signal with their eyes if they desperately wanted to be laid on the boardroom table”. She hadn't realised that he meant this literally and her eyes may have given an inadvertent twitch at some point; when she refused his subsequent and most unwelcome advances, he locked her out of the office. The judge did not dispute the evidence but told the woman that her boss had done nothing remiss: on the contrary, he was simply being gallant.

Another story: The story began on a July evening when a group of City lawyers from Shearman & Sterling went out drinking, as City lawyers so often do. After a few drinks, the group fragmented, and an associate peeled off to the Windmill strip club in Soho, taking with him the summer intern, a young female Oxford graduate. It isn't clear what happened once inside but, as a result, the girl filed a complaint to the firm's HR department, claiming that the associate had made suggestive remarks and tried to touch her. The firm looked into the matter, decided the associate had acted in a way that was “deeply inappropriate” and fired him. However, it was also made clear that, as the event was a private one, the firm itself was not liable.

What did people react?

Half think the story is a savage indictment of life in the City, and shows how wretched it still is for female lawyers, especially young ones. The other half are angry with the stupid woman, and furious that, in a wildly PC world, a lawyer lost his job without having done anything wrong. “HOPE SHE IS PLEASED WITH HERSELF FOR DESTROYING HIS LIFE,” went one post.

What's the author's view?

I don't think either is, but they share wrongness equally. The man was an idiot. You don't need to be a lawyer to know that strip club, summer intern and clumsy pass all add up to trouble. The intern was an idiot too. Once she realised she was being taken into what its website calls an “upmarket tableside dancing venue” she should have said: “Thanks for a pleasant evening but it's been a long day and I must go home now”, and taken herself off. In itself, this was a story of two silly people on a squalid little night out in London, and is of no particular interest.

The sexual harassment in Russia:

In that country, only two women have ever won cases for sexual harassment and, in one survey, 100 per cent of women claimed to have been harassed at some point.

What do you think of sexual harassment? Is it a good thing?

Aug 29, 2008 08:19	#1
JCNILE123 Points: Join Date: Mar 30, 2006 Status: Offline	Yes, it is ...for the russian pig and the judge, that is.

Aug 29, 2008 08:37

GUEST34129

There is a fine line between sexual harassment and sexual overture and often it depends on the situation. Girls don't mind being proposed to (for anything from a date to sex) by someone they like, and are physically attracted to, but run away as fast as they can if the guy is unattractive or dangerous. There is nothing worse than being trapped with a pig, even if they are handsome. It once happened to me, i was attacked by a guy whom i liked and who turned out to be a sexist pig. it really hurt my feelings and made me feel unsafe.

Aug 29, 2008 16:44	#3
DAVEC Points: Join Date: Apr 14, 2007 Status: Offline	Sexual harrasment is not a good thing, never has been and never will be.

Sep 1, 2008 04:36	#4
ZOEY Points: Join Date: Nov 29, 2004 Status: Offline	"Sexualharassment is a good thing: the human race would die out without it." I can't find the relationship between sexual harassment and human extinction. Without sexual harassment, human can live better. By the way, I agree with JC that the judge is as stupid as a pig (he must be a sexist). PS: not all Russians, only the judge has brain problems.

Sep 1, 2008 08:43	#5
APAULT Points: Join Date: Mar 11, 2006 Status: Offline	Katrina: you used the word 'harassment'. By definition, that is bad. The issue is when is an action harassment rather than poor judgement for example. I think you mostly answered the question yourself. You explored the issues and came to the opinion that there are grey areas which have two sides and we have problems when we try to see things in black and white terms.

Sep 1, 2008 20:39	#6
KATRINA Points: Join Date: Nov 29, 2004 Status: Offline	Paul, you see I just extract several paragraphs from an article on FT website. In that article, the author uses harassment. By the way, is there any other expressions that are better than "sexual harassment"?

Sep 2, 2008 05:45

DODGER
Points:
Join Date: Jul 15, 2007
Status: Offline

Perhaps slightly OT but a few years ago a friend of mine’s son was accused of aggravated rape by a girl that he had met.
He was arrested and spent 18 months on remand in Long Bay, a very rough prison in Sydney..
The boy swore to his Father that he was quilty..
The Father had to make his own inquiries into the matter as the police shown no interest in finding out the truth.
It cost this man over $200,000 to prove that his son was not guilty and that the girl had in fact made a false claim.
The son who was 18 tears old at the time has still not recovered from being sexually assaulted while in prison and is still receiving counseling.
The girl was never charged with committing perjury.
Perhaps the pendulum has swung too far?
Dodger.

Sep 2, 2008 23:24

GUEST21336

Well.. With the first example.. theres only one thing in common..a newcomer to the office being the ' victim '.
Woman No.1.. which is better Getting screwed on the board room table for the job...Or the alternative costing the job?
The judge in saying so might have saved her from ensuing revenge even.

Woman No.2 was purely lucky.. what would you do if a girl is with you all the way getting drunk.. then in a strip club with you.. ?
But firing a guy for that.. seems idiotic. but hey... that wouldnt have happened if he owned the firm.. he would still have fired the intern.. !

Sep 3, 2008 04:53	#9
MRJEDDI Points: Join Date: Sep 1, 2008 Status: Offline	Hi Katrina, I am really sorry about this. It is still unbelieveable how some men's behavior are. BR, MJ

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