| Am I wrong about this??? | |
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| Jul 23, 2007 10:58 |   |
 | I have commented to my friends on several occasions that that China appears to allow more personal/daily living freedom than in the United States. For example, never once was I asked to provide proof of age to get a beer in China, yet while waiting for my flight back to Montana I they asked for proof of age before serving me a beer (I am 56)...and there was no smoking allowed anywhere in the airport. While those are trivial examples, there are hundreds and hundreds of laws in the US that allow the authorities to harass a person or prevent them from doing something (like handing out pamphlets (based on anti-littering regulations)). I've talked with my Chinese friends about all sorts of things - including politics and have never noticed any concern about law enforcement. Of course, we are all law abiding people. I am a law abiding citizen in the US too, but have had police and government agents wrongfully meddling in my affairs frequently. While I have seen the Chinese police in action two or three times, I do not know the crime that provoked their response. I am of the opinion that with 1.3 billion people to police, the government has neither the time or any interest in responding to trivial indiscretions. However, I suspect if a person does attract the attention of the Chinese police or other Chinese authority the response and punishment will be swift and severe. (Just about the opposite from the United States where we often slap criminals on the wrist for heinous crimes.) Am I missing something? Or are my deductions from my observations reasonable? |
| Jul 23, 2007 11:19 | #1 |
| I don't think you are missing anything Griz, perhaps you're a very young 56!! I never had any problems getting a beer and I'm almost the same age ( 56 in October ). |
| Jul 23, 2007 20:47 | #2 |
| You are very true, Griz. China is the most populous country in the world. "The government has neither the time or any interest in responding to trivial indiscretions." In China, as along as you don't pose a threat to public security, the cop will never meddle in your personal affairs. |
| Jul 24, 2007 01:27 | #3 |
| A government official friend in Shanghai once gave me an introduction on that particular situation in China before. And here it goes, China's rule has always been based on 'person' as opposed to a 'system'. Yes there are systems but its execution is really up to the discretion of the person having that power to decide the outcome. For thousands of years, emporers and officials ruled in that manner. Now the only thing that has changed is the titles they hold. Many foreigners in China go down this route of understanding on the way law enforcement are perceived. If you really look at it, it is all about the person empowered to enforce laws to decide whether it is beneficial for him to do so and the 'system' is such that such benefits are almost always 'personal'. |
| Jul 24, 2007 07:02 | #4 |
| I think Claudius has hit the nail on the head with this one. The system in China has not changed for thousands of years but with a different set of cloths on to apear to have changed. With the US model nothing has realy changed either in their system of treating the plebs..very rude, *** and stupid. But I do look forward to the day when someone asks me for ID when I buy a beer Griz. |
| Jul 24, 2007 07:34 | #5 |
| China doesn't produce more alcoholic than America does, we have different systerms, not to say different cultures. We saw people, esp men dipped their chopsticks and then let the baby suck the chopstick, then came the bitter expression of the baby. You may say that's stupid, people would say that only after they learned about the western culture/ custom. LIke i said, no datas shows China produces more alcoholic than any other countries, except muslim countries i guess. Chinese are flexible, if you appear older than 18, no matter 2 years older or 200 years older, they will sell you the beer, it's funny to Chinese if people to ask for the proof of age if you look like 50. Nothing wrong, just you got the chance to see the difference between the western country and China. This is just one example of flexibility of Chinese. |
| Jul 24, 2007 10:01 | #6 |
| I suspect there is much more meaning in the comment from CLAUDIUS than I can comprehend. |
| Jul 24, 2007 20:10 | #7 |
| I've never been to US so I can't say which one is better. But I do think China's 'system' should be changed in some area. |
| Jul 24, 2007 23:34 | #8 |
| As for everything in life, there are pros and cons. If you have lived in China long enough, you would find the arbitrary adminstration of legal laws hard to comprehend. Basically a lot of legal matters can be "settled" using money. And he who is the wealthiest, has the most power. I would prefer a system where most things are transparent and above board. Like in Singapore. |
| Jul 25, 2007 04:13 | #9 |
| I guess, to put it simply, the multitude of people and their individual preferences do create a problem in enforcing law in China. However, since the earliest days, Chinese rulers served the hardest punishments for people who worked against them (and not the system). Let me explain. I'm always been advised to use a little extra force in dealing with my staff in China. Both in rewards and punishments. It is even ok to restrict their freedom and make them work >60 hour week, BUT provided you explain what's in it for them. Extremes are used as it is memorable enough. Just like punishments. Punish one hard enough and the rest will get in line. Problem is if you use this method, you can't really correct relatively minor issues, like smoking breaks that last >15 minutes. You'll appear as a tyrant or a super-egoistic boss who will eventually lose leadership points. At the end of the day, leaders will still want followers, esp in China. Thats why you will never have anyone check on your ID when you order beer, nobody will insult their own intelligence that way. But if a local Chinese decides to try his luck insulting a policeman in uniform, he may have to spend the next couple of weeks in a hospital. |
| Jul 25, 2007 12:40 | #10 |
| It sounds as if a visitor could not possibly understand the subtleties and may only truly understand how the system works if living in China for an extended time. May, I was not trying to suggest that one system is better or worse than the other system. Although I'd really like MY government to keep its nose out of my business when I am productive and law abiding citizen. My opinion about my government is that it should focus its energies to catch and prosecute criminals - something it seems to avoid doing. The systems appear to be different, but perhaps the bottom line is just about the same. :-) |
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